In this encore episode, we explore the mental health benefits of yoga with guest Addie deHilster. Addie, a mindfulness meditation teacher and certified yoga therapist, discusses her work integrating movement modalities like Yin yoga to enhance mindfulness and meditation practices. We discuss how Yin yoga, described as embodied meditation, provides mental health benefits, including stress resilience and improved nervous system regulation.
- Understanding Yin Yoga
- Mental health benefits of Yin Yoga
MEET Addie DeHilster
Addie deHilster is a Mindfulness Meditation Teacher and C-IAYT Yoga Therapist. Her passion is teaching movement practices that “unlock” mindfulness skills, and helping students gain traction in their meditation practice so they can be more present in their lives. Yin Yoga is one of the main modalities she practices and teaches, as it is an excellent doorway into embodied meditative stillness. Now based in Vancouver, Washington (USA), she previously owned and operated a community yoga studio in Los Angeles, California, for over five years. A dedicated practitioner of Buddhist Insight Meditation, she has accumulated over four months of silent retreat practice over the years. She is a graduate of the Mindfulness Mentor Training with Jack Kornfield and Tara Brach, the InsightLA Mindfulness Facilitator Training, and the 2014-15 Mindfulness Yoga & Meditation Training Program at Spirit Rock Meditation Center, which is a program dedicated to weaving together the wisdom traditions of Hatha Yoga and Buddhist meditation. She has studied Yin Yoga with Bernie Clark, Paul Grilley, and Sarah Powers. Addie is the founder of the Moved to Meditate Class Library, the host of the Moved To Meditate Podcast, and she offers online Yin Yoga Teacher Trainings with a mindful, therapeutic emphasis.
Find out more at Move To Meditate
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Transcript
ENCORE_E98_AddieDeHilster_HCP_NOINTRO
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Chris McDonald: [:So whether you're here to expand your skills, enhance your self-care, or both. You are in the right place. Join me on this journey to help you be one step closer to bringing Yoga into your therapy room
and it is so amazing. Addie [:Her passion is teaching movement practices that unlock mindfulness skills and help students gain traction in their meditation practice so they can be more present for their lives. Yin yoga is one of the main modalities she practices and teaches, and it's an excellent doro and to embodied meditative stillness.
A fun fact about her is she loves being outside. She and her husband moved to Washington State about a year and a half ago, and it's a hiker's heaven. Welcome to the podcast, Addie.
Addie DeHilster: Oh, thank you so much, Chris. That was such a warm welcome and um, I'm really honored to be here and joining you on your podcast, which is amazing.
Chris McDonald: Yeah. So can you tell my listeners more about yourself and your work?
s. I'm like a big Qigong fan [:So I basically love movement, but I also have this side of me that really loves stillness and I have a long time meditation practice. So my work has really become about that kind of interplay between movement and stillness, and using the movement practices to unlock the mindfulness. Skills and techniques because it's not always easy to just like sit down and meditate.
So I find that these practices can be a lot more powerful and effective when we kind of combine them together and use movement to highlight mindfulness skills that we can then apply in meditation and use meditation as a way to really get more. In tune with what's going on. So then even our movement practices become richer and more interesting.
his wonderful feedback loop. [:And, um. At the studio, we did a lot of therapeutic type yoga practices, more contemplative types of, uh, movement practices. And I had a meditation circle there, so it was a little bit different than other neighborhood yoga studios. But I do teach online now.
Chris McDonald: Yeah, the name of your podcast. I, I just love 'cause and I think a lot of people don't understand that using movement before meditation is what can really help your meditation practice.
parts of meditation. So it's [:Yeah. It's sort of a, a play on words that, you know, I want it to feel like joyable and accessible and like you feel moved to do it.
Chris McDonald: How would you describe yin yoga? Because I know that's your favorite.
Addie DeHilster: It's one of my favorites. Yeah, for sure. Um, it's one of my favorite modalities because it really is like an embodied meditation.
And when I discovered yen yoga years ago, it was like this missing link really lit up for me because I've had a pretty active yoga practice and I'd had my mindfulness meditation, my insight meditation practice going, and they had kind of felt. A little bit separate and I, I certainly learned them from different teachers and in different centers and, and things like that.
But like, I'm one person and [:Yeah. It was like embodied meditation because the yin practices were yoga poses, but they're held for quite a long time, and they're more still, they're more passive and supported by props, and they gave me the time to kind of be in that media. Space. So it, it really connected a lot of dots for me and that's, you know, for me, why it became a favorite and a gateway that I've used to help others to kind of move towards meditation practices or to integrate their meditation and movement practices.
has not been positive. So if [:I was like, okay, let me just try it, but let me tell you, so I thought I was gonna die because I have chronic pain issues. I have spondylothesis in my low back and uh, I have to be very careful with yoga. I can't do all kinds of yoga and I have to do a lot on modifying. And anyway, sometimes I stop during yoga classes and just do my own thing because if I feel too much pain, but.
hen you said mentioned about [:So tell me more about that.
Addie DeHilster: Yeah. And I'm so happy you brought this up 'cause I've heard it so many times and it's, it's, it's a shame that, you know, people are having these experiences with a practice that is meant to be yin. Like, so like if we just start there. You know, yin versus yang. Yin is the cool side, the shady side of the mountain.
It's the moon yang is the sun and the, the heat and the effort. And so if we're really practicing in a yin like way, first of all, you know, it's slow and it's gentle. It's mindful and we have to do that in a way that's supportive to our own individual bodies. Otherwise, it becomes a struggle and it becomes young and it becomes effort, right?
does not make it restorative [:And we really need to support the body to hold postures in a sustainable way for the three to five to six minutes that we intend to hold them in a yin yoga class. Otherwise, we can't really make the pose into a meditative experience because we're just like fighting with ourselves and we're in pain and we're just struggling with the body.
So the prop, the props are really, really essential and everyone will use them a little bit differently. It's not that there's like one set way that we. I would use them, but that as you come into the pose, you're feeling into what you need and you're, you're kind of assessing like the sensations that are showing up that day, and then you're adding a blanket or a pillow accordingly.
g. And then you can actually [:Chris McDonald: exactly.
Which to me, speaking from the nervous system that it probably just brought me in sympa sympathetic activation circle, big
Addie DeHilster: time. You know, it's well intentioned and there's value for sure of, you know, how to become comfortable with discomfort, which we can talk about more. But that doesn't mean like 10 out of 10 on the intensity scale.
It's not titrated, right? Like we need to actually work with the nervous system in a, in a more gentle. Way in order for that to be productive and not to just kick us up into sympathetic activation, like you said.
Chris McDonald: Yeah, no, I appreciate, uh, clarifying that difference. 'cause it, it just seemed like this is not relaxing at all when I was doing it.
body who's had an experience [:Chris McDonald: Right. 'cause the point isn't to create a lot of pain, like you said, on that pain scale. Should, you shouldn't be that high on a pain scale.
Addie DeHilster: No. You shouldn't really be that high on a sensation scale at all. Like if you wanna take the sensations you know of stretch and kind of put them on a intensity scale, I would say in, in yin yoga, we wanna be like around a.
very sustainable. One of the [:We have so much conditioning that like, we need to do more or we've gotta like do it to the max in order to get the benefit or you know, it's like that old, no pain, no gain cliche and it comes into yen yoga in this way. Oh, I'm sure. Where, you know, it's just like we have to, this is a big part of what I do and I teach yen yoga, is to kind of like flip the script on that and say like, well, can we do less?
Can we slow down? What if it's a little more subtle? What is that like?
Chris McDonald: It sounds like exploring maybe a little more too.
Addie DeHilster: Yeah. You caught me on my soapbox already. I'm like, woo, let's go. We're starting off strong
Chris McDonald: here on the Holistic Counseling podcast. Yeah, for sure. Well, I guess how would you describe, I know you talked some about it, but how would you say that Yin yoga's different from other types of yoga?
of yoga are. Active movement [:But the yen poses tend to be three to five minutes long. They tend to be on the floor. And they tend to be passive, or that's the idea is that we can do them without muscular engagement. So that's another reason that we need to use the props because you can't always, you know, hold a butterfly shape or a forward fold without muscular engagement unless there's something there for your, your bones to kind of rest into.
restorative yoga you're not [:And in yin we do allow for. A little bit of edge of sensation again on that we're like three to four on the intensity scale, and we use that as a mindfulness tool, as a way of learning how to be with sensations. And the other difference, just as a slight, you know, side note for those who are wondering between yin and restorative, is that yin yoga has a basis in Chinese medicine and the meridian system and the yin yang theory that comes from Taoism.
So that's. Not really part of restorative yoga. So it, it has, it has a few different traits to it.
Chris McDonald: Are you a mental health therapist interested in bringing yoga into your therapy room, but feel uncertain where to start? Maybe you're worried about staying ethical or want to feel more confident in what you're offering.
and competence with Yoga and [:Step into the therapy room with confidence and transform your sessions today. Go to HC podcast.org/build confidence. That's HC podcast.org/build confidence. Yeah, so what are the mental health benefits of Ian Yoga?
Addie DeHilster: Yeah, that's such a good question. And I think there are quite a few. And you know, part of it is just that Yin yoga is a mindfulness practice.
e throughout the day and yin [:It can help us learn to kind of regulate our nervous system around that and to notice our habits. Like, do we tend to push into more intensity or do we tend to hold back from intensity? You know? So it relates a lot to stress, resilience and how we can kind of expand that capacity to, to be with whatever is coming up.
Again, that's not the same as just like throwing ourselves at the deep end, right? But. You know, kind of the way some people, um, these days, one of the trends is taking cold showers. You know, have you heard about this?
Chris McDonald: Where No, I haven't.
Addie DeHilster: Ice baths and cold showers and people are using them as a way to like stimulate the vagus nerve or to Oh,
Chris McDonald: okay.
like to kind of shock their [:Chris McDonald: stress tolerance in mental health therapist speak.
Addie DeHilster: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So we could do that with sensation in a yin pose. Ah, okay. It's doesn't have to be like cold water pouring down you Right.
Um, 'cause the cold shower thing does not sound too dirty. Me, that doesn't sound good
Chris McDonald: to me.
Addie DeHilster: My brother is really into them. He was talking about it over Thanksgiving and he really likes it. But I was like, you know, I can do that in a yin pose. Like I could come into exactly a forward fold and sort of feel like.
m initially might label as a [:Sensation. That's one example. Yeah,
Chris McDonald: of course.
Addie DeHilster: I also find, you know, just the basic practice of yen yoga helps to get us out of our heads, you know, helps to get us into the body. 'cause we are feeling sensation, we are feeling a sense of contact with the floor or my forehead resting on a bolster, or I'm feeling my breath flowing in and out of the body.
I'm feeling perhaps that stretch sensation and that can help to interrupt the kind of. Dominance of thinking patterns and the habits. Overthinking. Overthinking, absolutely. And it can down-regulate the nervous system. And there is some research about, you know, how long, gentle, long supported stretches can affect certain receptors in our fascia called.
t's physiological as well as [:Chris McDonald: Yeah. 'cause I know most. Clients I see live from the neck up, they're not in their bodies. So as I think a lot of the population, right, if they're not doing these practices, so, so getting people into the body is more integrative and holistic and being able to process emotion. And, and I know you mentioned too, just noticing sensation and, and I think you said pushing the edge of it too, which makes me think about the window of tolerance.
Addie DeHilster: Exactly. Yeah. So we work at
Chris McDonald: the edge of that. Can you talk more about that?
the window's smaller and so [:We have more capacity, we have more space internally. And the little things maybe don't bother us as much, or we have more capacity to take on new challenges or take a few risks or try new things, right? So we're, we're moving out of that kind of very narrow state of comfort and opening up possibilities for ourselves, which is beautiful.
And. So our yoga practice can absolutely be a safe space in which to explore that because it's easier to sort of do that on your yoga mat, I think, than it is to do that when you're in a staff meeting or when you're, you know, having a tense conversation with your teenager in the car on the way home from school.
but you know, I can imagine. [:Chris McDonald: Oh yeah.
Addie DeHilster: You know, it's so, it's a place where we can practice and build those kinds of skills and set ourselves up for being able to roll with things in our real life a little bit better, a little bit more skillfully. Does that make sense?
Chris McDonald: Yes. Yes. No, I think that, I talked to clients about that as well.
I think that's really important tool to understand that window of tolerance. And then we have the, if we go outside of it, the top part of the window, we could become activated with anxiety. And then the lower end is, is more of the depressive or shut down of the nervous system. But I think yoga really can be such a tool for helping us regulate and, and opening the window, which I love.
nd so we start to be able to [:And that's, that's what I mean when I'm talking about mindfulness. Skills, right? It's not just relaxation practice. It's like teaching us things about how we operate that we can use. And I think that the yin practice can be a great laboratory for that because it gives us a simple task. You know, be in this pose for five minutes, but so much can come up when it's like, well, I'm feeling this.
What does that mean? What should I do? And then I'm having this reaction and now I'm seeing this thought pattern come up and I'm seeing how. That sort of habit of mind that maybe affects me over here, you know, in my regular life is showing up here on my yoga mat. And that's really interesting. So I think it, it just gives us a, a place that we can start to observe, but we can also start to experiment and try some new things and relate to those.
Those things differently
is McDonald: because I think [:It's okay, we have these emotions and, and I think that lessens it somehow too. Once we can just accept it. And just be with it.
Addie DeHilster: Yeah, absolutely. And when you say that they're afraid of that sensation, do you mean like a, a pain sensation? Yeah. Or like the, the knot in your stomach of anxiety kind of sensation or,
Chris McDonald: oh, yeah.
I think that a lot are just, yeah, all of them, I think just related to that and, and try to avoid, right. That becomes an automatic response to avoid Okay. That, oh, they might know that that triggers anxiety. I feel that. Not in my stomach. Okay. I just gotta push that away.
uction and stress resilience [:And we can't even really control the physiological responses that our body might have to those things. Right? And it has so much to do with how we're wired. And I think if we start to understand that the body and the nervous system are really just trying to protect us, and that that physiological stress is the body like gearing up to do what it needs to do to help you survive.
to look at that and go, huh, [:A threat at the moment, or is my mind starting to interpret this in the way that it always does? Yes, because it's feeling this sensation and it's applying kind of a, a habitual label to it, so we can start to see through some of those. Those things and some of the maybe cognitive distortions that we have towards, you know, assuming the worst or over generalizing.
Chris McDonald: Catastrophizing. Yeah,
Addie DeHilster: totally catastrophizing. And we can start to unwind that a little bit and that can really make us more resilient. That's really where we start to expand that window of tolerance, right? And that ability to like just have a different perspective that doesn't assume it knows what's going to happen, but that can be responsive as opposed to having the same reaction over and over again.
system for clients can be so [:That's part of mindfulness too, isn't it?
Addie DeHilster: Absolutely. Yeah. Mindfulness is a, you know, observing, curious state of awareness, right? It's bringing that. Curiosity and in a non-judgmental way to all of our experience, whatever it might be. And so it can notice the beautiful moments and it can notice those moments of discomfort, but without jumping into an interpretation about it can take them and just become curious like, huh, what's going on right now?
what's going on there. Maybe [:Maybe not. Or if I go into my more habitual, catastrophizing mode. I might feel that sensation in my shoulder and go, oh, uhoh, there's pain. What did I do? Did I work out too much yesterday? Or Oh, was it that I typing too much? I'm sitting at the computer too much. Like, oh, should I go to the doctor? Or what if I went to physical surgery?
Are you in my head, Addie, you know, it's like, oh, oh gosh, what if I have to have surgery? What if my insurance doesn't cover it? Oh my gosh. You know? And the anxiety train, what I call that. Exactly. Exactly. So. It's like that's just an example of the kinds of thought patterns that we can start to recognize just from this skill of being able to mindfully notice a sensation without jumping 12 miles down the road without labeling it automatically as pain, but just going, huh?
ation A kind at this moment. [:Chris McDonald: Yeah, I like that. But I think, you know what's powerful? 'cause I had a client recently that learned to just look at the her thoughts as just thoughts. Yeah. And it sounds so simple, but it's just kind of taking the emotional edge off of that.
And it's just a thought. Let me just notice it. Like with meditation or mindfulness, see as a cloud floating by letting it go. And you don't have to believe your thoughts. It's the beauty of it. Exactly. It doesn't mean it's reality. Yeah, that's, it doesn't, that's huge.
Addie DeHilster: And at the same time, our mind is, it's just like a meaning making machine and it's just trying to.
Predict the future, right. To protect us. Yes. You know, it's trying to figure this out, but it's, um, the world is a little too complex for that. So the resilience comes from just learning to, to trust that we can respond in the moment without having to anticipate everything.
Chris McDonald: That's powerful right there, isn't it?
Addie DeHilster: It is for me. Yes.
d I think noticing too that, [:Reminding clients of that too is important.
Addie DeHilster: I think being able to recognize that is, is huge. And I would love, you know, for people to sort of apply that measure of progress to yoga as well. Yes. Instead of looking at yoga and saying, well, am I more flexible as the measure of progress? You know, look at it and, and say like, internally, am I more flex?
nd we, we have the space and [:To, to really observe, to really notice. 'cause we're not just moving from post to post to post to pose. Yes. There's time, there's, there's space
Chris McDonald: and slowness creates awareness.
Addie DeHilster: It does. And slowness is challenging. It's, I mean this is one of the great things about y yoga, but that makes it challenging because we are living.
Sped up lives. And so sometimes to try to meditate or to try to do a practice like yin, that's fairly still, that can be kind of confronting,
Chris McDonald: you know? Oh, for sure.
Addie DeHilster: That can be really kind of challenging too. So that's again, where we, we need these mindfulness skills to learn how to be with that. So it's not just coming into.
ning the spotlight on all of [:Chris McDonald: Yeah, exactly. So being present to observe and, and not getting caught up in stories.
Addie DeHilster: Yeah, exactly.
Chris McDonald: Or Or catastrophizing
Addie DeHilster: sensation. Making new stories, new stories. Right,
Chris McDonald: exactly. But I think once you get in the body, like I know you mentioned the bottom up processing too. I mean that's, a lot of therapists are really interested in that, especially listeners that are wanting to use more yoga session.
our brain goes offline when [:Addie DeHilster: Exactly. It's not available when we're in that, that like outside of our window of tolerance, we need to get back in the window to be in the healing zone, right? Yes. Otherwise, like. We can, we can't talk ourselves out of, of that, that state of being dysregulated.
Chris McDonald: Yeah, for sure. Yeah.
Addie DeHilster: So these, like, these embodiment tools are huge and the good thing is they're simple so we can learn them and.
Teach them to those around us so that they can be used when they're needed. And the more we use them, the more skillful they get.
Chris McDonald: What's a favorite mindful movement activity do you like or pose? Whatever you wanna call it.
Addie DeHilster: Yeah. Well, we've talked a lot about, you know, the stillness of yin poses, but I also do love.
, I might just like stand up [:Whatever irritation or agitations there. And then I can shake, so I'll stand and I'll just like shake my limbs and bounce my legs. And some of these are things that are done in Qigong as well, but cl like kind of energy clearing practices. They are really helpful for letting go of excess charge and the nervous system so that then we can maybe like see a little more clearly or take a deeper breath or have a pause or do a meditation.
Chris McDonald: Yeah. To me that's like the reset button. Right?
Addie DeHilster: And I do it multiple times a day. It's, it's, yeah. Mm-hmm. Highly needed.
Chris McDonald: Exactly. 'cause the world is very activating,
news or something, you know, [:Personally happened. It's just like we need to reset so many times. Otherwise we just carry around a lot of like extra charge and we're set up to be reactive.
Chris McDonald: So what's a takeaway you could share today that could help listeners that might be just starting their holistic journey?
Addie DeHilster: Oh, I love that. And I just acknowledge anybody who's starting that journey and hope that they're led by their curiosity and by kindness.
And to know that little things count, like those little moments, those little movement breaks, those little pauses they really add up. So don't feel like you have to do an hour a day for it to matter. It's gonna make a difference little by little. And if you start small, you have a better chance of being consistent.
'cause it, it's better to do yes. Five minutes a day and do it more consistently than to do an hour, but only do it once a month.
ou and learn more about you? [:Addie DeHilster: Well, um, you can go to my website, which is moved to meditate.yoga. Which is MOV ed, like moved to meditate yoga, and if you wanna try out some practices with me, I have a video class library and there's a, a way you can sign up for a free library card, as I call it.
Oh. I have a free tier where there's five different classes on a rotation every month that are available to practice for free. So you just have to sign up for the library card to check those out. And I also have yin yoga teacher trainings that will be coming up in the spring and mindful movement teacher training in the fall.
And I have my podcast, so that's right. Chris is gonna be a guest soon.
Chris McDonald: Woohoo. I can't wait. Yeah,
Addie DeHilster: I'm excited too, and just excited to keep the connection going so anything can be found pretty much on my website.
Chris McDonald: That's wonderful. Well, thank you so much for coming on the podcast, Addie.
ng me and for bringing these [:Chris McDonald: Thanks for listening to today's episode. The information in this podcast is for general informational and educational purposes only. It is given with the understanding that neither the host, the publisher, or the guests are giving legal, medical, psychological, or any other kind of professional advice. We are not responsible for any losses, damages, or liability.
That may arise from the use of this podcast. Yoga is not recommended for everyone and is not safe under certain medical conditions. Always check with your doctor to see if it's safe for you. If you need a professional, please find the right one for you.
